Test Realm Patch Notes: 2.4.3

[Taelas]

*sigh* You're missing the point. Its the combination of Frost Bite and Ice armor that would be so rough on a melee class.

I'm not missing the point. It only affects melee classes with purge, i.e. only Enhancement shamans. Retribution paladins can still get out of it with BoF and Cleanse, so why mention them?

It only affects non-purge classes if they are paired with a purge-class. Ice Armor being undispellable means jack to a Ret paladin unless the Ret paladin is relying on a shaman or a priest or a warlock's Felhunter to remove Ice Armor.

In any event, Frostbite is still not a big deal. Good warriors exploit Frostbite to throw a crit back in the Mage's face via Spell Reflection, rogues can get out of Frostbite any number of ways, paladins can Cleanse it even if their BoF is on CD, and the rest of the classes have ranged spells, meaning that it doesn't affect their abilty to retaliate. An Enhancement shaman would have the most problems with Frostbite, yes -- but I still don't see the problem. I consider slowing effects on warriors far worse.

Are being intentionally obtuse here? Or is it just because you don't PvP much that you don't realize how massively this hurts Enhancement Shammies? Hell, it probably hurts all melee, even Rogues.

You realize that a mage has a 50% greater chance to crit against a frozen target, right? And that ice lance does triple damage against frozen targets? So that instant cast spell is now capable of doing six times normal damage (thanks to Ice Shards, before Resilience adjustments.) It's entirely possible to have Ice Lance - an instant-cast spell with a massive 36 yard talented range - crit for 2000 or more against high-resilience targets. Against low-resilience targets, it's not unusual to see numbers going beyond 3000.

...

You're not a mage, obviously. 3000? Are you nuts, or do you just think it's appropriate to add a Berserker buff to everything? Ice Lance doesn't hit for 500 unless you have upwards of 2500 spelldamage. It's gets a 14.29% coefficient, and the base damage is ~174.

It's a great spell, but you're VASTLY overestimating it. Ice Lance is amazing when you combine it with a Frostbolt, or if you manage to get off three or more Ice Lances against a target affected by Frostbite. On its own, it's not something to worry about.

Just to give you an estimation, you'd need around 1300 spelldamage before Ice Lance crits for 2000. Without considering anything else.

Also -- the talented range for Ice Lance is 33 yards, not 36. At least try to get your facts straight.

Not only this, but because enhancement shammies and rogues - who dual wield and thus attack very quickly - are going to have a much higher chance to proc Frostbite. Rogues can probably get out of it if they need to via Cloak of Skill or their other get out of jail free cards, but for a shammy, the only option he has is to try and dispel ice armor, which they're seemingly intent on changing. This now leaves you with the option of either trinketing (and just being rooted with frost nova, freeze, or another frostbite proc a few seconds later) or bending over and grabbing your ankles.

Moreover, any melee attacking the mage will now be moving at 70% speed because of the chill effect; for Warriors and Rogues this isn't a major problem because they can just keep Hamstring/Piercing Howl/Crippling Poison on the mage and keep up just fine. But for Retribution Paladins, who will be reliant on Blessing of Freedom (which can be stolen or dispelled), and Enhancement Shamans, this is a serious issue.

What, you never use Cleanse?

Yeah, it's a serious issue for Enhancement shaman. So what? The game isn't balanced around 1v1.

Oh yeah -- shaman will effectively get Cleanse themselves in WotLK.