07-17-2003, 03:44 PM
Hi,
It seems to me that the intention is to lead people by the nose towards more complex game play: starting afresh, playing no-twink, knowing when to run, no dupes being available at least initially. At the same time the new system will preserve an area for those people who can't bear to compete on an even footing, along with players who simply like their characters, enjoy doing what they've always done and want to keep on with the same old gameplay albeit in a more challenging environment
Yes. And when the ladder reset comes, the first group will be forced to join the second group or start over. Since most of the first group will have become the first group because they were trying to avoid the second, starting over becomes the most likely option. While I, like you, start many characters and drop them after a while, I don't relish the thought that I will be forced to restart my characters at a time not of my choosing! I do not play 24/7 or even as much as an hour or two a day. It usually takes me a day per waypoint, roughly. Say a month and a half to two months to run a character through. Which means, if the ladder season is three months, then I have no desire to start a character after the first month since that character might become useless before *I* am through with it.
I agree with you, trashing characters and starting over is fun. But I feel that we, not Buzzard, should determine when one of our characters is "finished".
To talk about the economy crashing on a ladder reset is nonsense. The non-Ladder economy is pretty much fixed now as vast reserves of currency already exist. It will continue in the same way it does now (SoJs, Windforces and so on). Ladder items appearing in the economy will not affect it because there will be too few items of value - there are few items designated Ladder only and surely there are a fair number of dupers with dozens of accounts full of Windforce mules
Hold on. First, "there will be too few items of value". Do you mean that there will be too few types or too few copies of those types? If you mean too few types, remember that the economy now is based on a half dozen or less items. If a new half dozen *better* items come from the ladder, the original items of value will become worthless (since the economy is pretty much binary: an item is either worth a lot or it is worth next to nothing). If you mean that too few copies (or perhaps "instances" would be better -- let's be naive and assume Buzzard manages to prevent ladder duping), that might be possible, depending on how many people play the ladder, how much they play, and how hard it will be to find/make the new uber items. If there aren't very many instances of uber items in circulation when they get dumped into the normal realm, then you might be right and they will not become the *basis* of the economy. They will still disrupt the economy because the buyers are typically looking for the best items available *now*, not a few months ago.
So, I think you are underestimating the effect of ladder items flooding the normal economy. Of course, that presumes they will, indeed, be permitted to enter normal. If not, then the people who have those items on their ladder characters will get a double screwing.
The Ladder system is an attempt to address the problem that the non-Ladder realms will never be cleaned up.
Well, duh. Yes, and it is a neat way for Buzzard to try to keep a clean environment. Every time a new exploit is developed that turns the Ladder into a cesspool and Buzzard can't (or won't) figure a way to clean it up, all they have to do is declare a new season. Presto, a fresh blank page. So, it is a great solution from that perspective. I just don't see it as a great solution from the perspective of the honest players who are told that, just because some sewage has gotten into their pool they are going to be flushed away to the sewage treatment plant (normal realms) with the crap.
As to the rest, you have some sound arguments. But time will tell. A lot depends on a few factors, such as how much warning Buzzard will give before resetting the ladder, what they will do with the "ladder only" items of the "demoted" characters, how well they avoid (and fix) exploits on the ladder. Predictions are difficult. You seem to think they'll pull it off. I remember the duping and MS bug in D1 (which modders fixed but Buzzard didn't) and have not much faith.
--Pete
It seems to me that the intention is to lead people by the nose towards more complex game play: starting afresh, playing no-twink, knowing when to run, no dupes being available at least initially. At the same time the new system will preserve an area for those people who can't bear to compete on an even footing, along with players who simply like their characters, enjoy doing what they've always done and want to keep on with the same old gameplay albeit in a more challenging environment
Yes. And when the ladder reset comes, the first group will be forced to join the second group or start over. Since most of the first group will have become the first group because they were trying to avoid the second, starting over becomes the most likely option. While I, like you, start many characters and drop them after a while, I don't relish the thought that I will be forced to restart my characters at a time not of my choosing! I do not play 24/7 or even as much as an hour or two a day. It usually takes me a day per waypoint, roughly. Say a month and a half to two months to run a character through. Which means, if the ladder season is three months, then I have no desire to start a character after the first month since that character might become useless before *I* am through with it.
I agree with you, trashing characters and starting over is fun. But I feel that we, not Buzzard, should determine when one of our characters is "finished".
To talk about the economy crashing on a ladder reset is nonsense. The non-Ladder economy is pretty much fixed now as vast reserves of currency already exist. It will continue in the same way it does now (SoJs, Windforces and so on). Ladder items appearing in the economy will not affect it because there will be too few items of value - there are few items designated Ladder only and surely there are a fair number of dupers with dozens of accounts full of Windforce mules
Hold on. First, "there will be too few items of value". Do you mean that there will be too few types or too few copies of those types? If you mean too few types, remember that the economy now is based on a half dozen or less items. If a new half dozen *better* items come from the ladder, the original items of value will become worthless (since the economy is pretty much binary: an item is either worth a lot or it is worth next to nothing). If you mean that too few copies (or perhaps "instances" would be better -- let's be naive and assume Buzzard manages to prevent ladder duping), that might be possible, depending on how many people play the ladder, how much they play, and how hard it will be to find/make the new uber items. If there aren't very many instances of uber items in circulation when they get dumped into the normal realm, then you might be right and they will not become the *basis* of the economy. They will still disrupt the economy because the buyers are typically looking for the best items available *now*, not a few months ago.
So, I think you are underestimating the effect of ladder items flooding the normal economy. Of course, that presumes they will, indeed, be permitted to enter normal. If not, then the people who have those items on their ladder characters will get a double screwing.
The Ladder system is an attempt to address the problem that the non-Ladder realms will never be cleaned up.
Well, duh. Yes, and it is a neat way for Buzzard to try to keep a clean environment. Every time a new exploit is developed that turns the Ladder into a cesspool and Buzzard can't (or won't) figure a way to clean it up, all they have to do is declare a new season. Presto, a fresh blank page. So, it is a great solution from that perspective. I just don't see it as a great solution from the perspective of the honest players who are told that, just because some sewage has gotten into their pool they are going to be flushed away to the sewage treatment plant (normal realms) with the crap.
As to the rest, you have some sound arguments. But time will tell. A lot depends on a few factors, such as how much warning Buzzard will give before resetting the ladder, what they will do with the "ladder only" items of the "demoted" characters, how well they avoid (and fix) exploits on the ladder. Predictions are difficult. You seem to think they'll pull it off. I remember the duping and MS bug in D1 (which modders fixed but Buzzard didn't) and have not much faith.
--Pete
How big was the aquarium in Noah's ark?