Citizen's United II - the other foot
#27
(08-16-2013, 03:02 AM)Jester Wrote: [EDITED]

Oof. That was too long and fragmented by about a million times. Shorter:
Thanks... I was trying to figure out how to respond.
(08-16-2013, 03:02 AM)Jester Wrote: 1) You've got to be kidding me about Barack Obama.
I assume you mean about me considering him still a bit of an enigma. I guess with most other politicians who've sought the presidency, they've come with a track record. I just haven't seen too much on Obama prior to his partial US Senate term.
(08-16-2013, 03:02 AM)Jester Wrote: 2) You've got to be kidding me about Jack Hunter.
Look. What he wrote when he was "The Southern Avenger" is despicable and you may be right that deep down he's still a closet racist. The only part I was comparing to Mark Penn, was in Penn's failed "xenophobic / racist" lunatic strategy he advised for Hillary against Obama. The rejected and failed primary strategy that was then employed by Fox news during the election portraying Obama as a non-American outsider who attends an outrageous church, with dubious connections to shady people in his past. If I'm equivocating, it is just that all candidates make bad decisions in associations, and some are worse than others. Should Rezko's stink fall on Obama, no. But, even Obama called association with Rezko "boneheaded".
(08-16-2013, 03:02 AM)Jester Wrote: 3) You've got to be kidding me about Rand Paul.
Ok, here I'm not sure to what you are referring. Perhaps its just that it seems obvious you think Rand Paul is a racist. I just reject the notion that some constitutionalist ideas, like "states rights" are always code for KKK, white supremacy, bringing back slavery. This is what I originally meant by saying that sometimes his ideological pondering gets in the way of realistic legislation, and political coalition building. It's his way of putting his foot in his mouth.
(08-16-2013, 03:02 AM)Jester Wrote: 4) You've got to be kidding me about John Wilkes Booth.
Most of my life I've been led to think of JWB as a horrible, horrible assassin. Not much time is given in American History to attempt to understand what motivated Booth, or other southern "patriots"*. Yes, slavery was a core issue. Economically, it is similar to our current issue attempting to ban coal use. And, I will note here that people are not like inanimate things -- the inhumanity of slavery (including what is happening now) can never compare to the inanimate machinery and fuels of production. Abolitionists (and I would say green energy advocates) ARE morally correct, but I would disagree on the drastic and rushed actions they employed at that time. The political process is one of negotiating, debating, and compromising to reach as broad a consensus as is possible. From my studies I would say that the South declared secession from the union which they felt was their prerogative as a member of a republic of confederates. The North began the war with an attack at Fort Sumter. I believe it would have been a better course to ignore the southern secession, and continue to negotiate rather than go to war (with 620,000 killed). Lincoln, and the Republicans needed to better sell a path forward that eventually eliminated slavery, and lifted everyone to equality. Most importantly, it would have been the best course for black southerners to not destroy the south and figure out a better way to integrate them equally into American society. That was not Lincoln's plan.

* Using the term "patriot" here will be off putting for those who think JWB is a horrible, horrible assassin. For me, in analyzing historical people and their behaviors, historical context matters (i.e. the execution of Phoebe Harris). You mentioned OBL. This is apt, for he has a large number of people across the Islamic world who find he was more "patriot" than horrible, horrible terrorist mastermind. So, we may see JWB as a horrible, horrible assassin, but maybe also rightly, many southerners saw Lincoln as the guy who commanded the armies who burned their cities and towns, plundered their houses and fields, raped their women, killed thousands of civilians, vilified them, and made them suffer for generations paying for reconstruction and providing pensions for northern soldiers. There was plenty of horror for both sides of that war. Often it is our inhumanity that makes people like JWB and OBL.
”There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." - Hamlet (1.5.167-8), Hamlet to Horatio.

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RE: Citizen's United II - the other foot - by kandrathe - 08-19-2013, 06:32 PM

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