Defensive Stance

[Tal]

First off, A Warrior's job IMHO is NOT to pull. A Warrior has minimal ranged abilities and virtually NO crowd-control abilities, both of which are ESSENTIAL to proper pulling. [right][snapback]66387[/snapback][/right]

Except if the warrior pulls he's automatically at the top of every mob's hate list and I don't have to pull aggro off a rogue. Not saying that a rogue can't pull or a hunter, just why many warriors prefer to do the pulling.

Now, let's analyze your observations, one by one. You state that a Warrior's job is to stand there and get beat on while everyone ELSE piles on the damage. This is wholly absurd. First off, Warriors are DPS machines. The only ones who can compete with them are Rogues and Mages - the former not being able to stand up to long fights due to medium Health, and the latter having to cast spells from afar.
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hahahahahahahahahaha - the idea of any warrior, in the current state of the realms being a DPS machine on par with rogues, mages and hunters is what is absurd. To do any damage the warrior has to be in Battle or Berserker Stance - both of which are not ideal for controlling aggro. Not saying it can't be done, just that the best skills for maintaining aggro are in defensive stance and they have the best damage mitigating abilities in defensive. I once grouped with a warrior for temple who stayed in Beserk stance for multi-mob pulls (many mobs there are immune to poly and sap incidentally) and the priest AND me healing him continuously were not enough to keep him alive in Berserker stance. We tried the pull again (after rezing) in defensive and lived through it.

If the Rogue can pull a single mob, without worry of attracting any further attention, he should do so with a ranged Throw attack, and then run back to JUST behind or beside the Tank(s) (but NOT any further, as you do NOT want the mob getting close to the casters). He then should perform a Feint, while maintaining NO offensive action towards his target (a quick left-click while running from the mob will remove you from attacking it, thus allowing you to stand still while the Tank attempts to get aggro). The Tank(s)'s job is to sit tight while the Rogue does this, and once the mob gets within range, IMMEDIATELY pull out all his aggro-inducing skills and start whailing on the mob. Casters should, obviously, wait several seconds before unloading any heavy damage, as should the Rogue, although most Rogues can handle a few beatings without trouble AND can use Feint, Gouge, or Vanish to remove themselves from harm.
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If a rogue can pull a single mob with a ranged throw, so can I with a bow or gun. And in later instances there will be multi-mob pulls because the critters in question are immune to sap or polymorph - the dragons in Temple being an example of this. And iirc the undead in places such as Scholomance are immune to sap and polymorph as well. The idea of always having the rogue or hunter pull is as much a fallacy as stating a warrior should always pull. Adapt to the situation at hand and fully expect for things to go wrong. There are times when you're going to want everything pounding on the warrior rather than a rogue and times where you'll want a hunter to pull at a greater range. Adapt.

As a Tank, your job is to stand put and maintain aggro. If for any reason a mob breaks off from you, you are NOT to break combat with your current mob to engage the other. You ARE supposed to attempt to use your short-ranged aggro-inducing skills (you have Shouts for a reason; use them), while holding your ground and keeping your original target on YOU. If your original target was the only target you were facing, then and ONLY then do you EVER move to where the casters are, at which point you pull the mob off, and then THEY back off to a safe distance once more, while you stand still and hold the mob's aggro. But if there are multiple mobs, and one should break off from you and head for a caster, it is the ROGUE'S job to pull that mob off, NOT yours.
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That is the recipe for dead rogue in my experience. Its the tank's responsibility to maintain aggro on all hostiles. If one breaks for the casters and there isn't another tank around then I'm going after it if for no other reason than the priest has more mana to cast on keeping me alive without having to worry about healing the rogue too. I hate to keep saying this but its unfortunately true: in later instances mobs will chew through a rogue's armor like paper. Any party looking to do these instances will have to have the ability to add another tank into the fight whether it be pet, paladin, shaman, or even hunter to be effective. If your'e going to act as a peeler than your best bet as a rogue is to gouge and wait for the tank to regain aggro before turning back to the main mob.

Wait for the cavalry to arrive and pull the mob off you. A Mage firing off a Frost Nova,  a Warlock casting Fear, or a Priest casting Psychic Scream are about the only exceptions to this. [right][snapback]66387[/snapback][/right]

With the exception of the frost nova this is also a recipe for disaster. Fear and Psychic scream are the enemies of crowd control in instances. Don't DO IT. The last thing I need as a tank is to have to scramble madly after a set of mobs because a warlock or priest panicked and feared/screamed.

Once the Rogue has pulled aggro off the casters, it is up to HIM whether or not he can handle that solo mob by himself (and Healers come into play here; a Rogue is not nearly as sturdy as a Warrior, Paladin, or Bear-form Druid, so we may require at least some healing to survive). If he can, then by all means he should do so. The battle has already gotten way more complicated than it should have; no need to make things any more complicated and risk making matters worse. If, however, the Rogue cannot, for any reason, handle the mob solo, he should then quickly decide how best to handle the situation. If the target was Sapped (see above), then the target will be taken care of for at least 25 seconds, provided no one else does something stupid - like damage the mob. Otherwise, the Rogue's best option at this point is generally the same as the process for pulling. That is, the Rogue should draw the monster back into the Tank(s)'s melee range and then STOP inducing any aggro. Feint is specifically designed to do nothing BUT reduce aggro, while the Tank(s) has skills geared towards GAINING aggro which he should use.
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I would prefer, as the tank, for the rogue to not attempt to offtank an add. Mana spent healing more than is necessary can spell disaster for a long fight. Its better if the priest doesn't have to spend any on unnecessary heroics. If I've lost aggro on a mob and it goes for the squishies then I go after it. The mob I still have aggro on will follow and I can bring the add back into the fold. This is why I prefer that mages/warlocks follow the main assist advice that Olon posted.

I hope I wasn't too harsh, but I HATE it when some cocky Warrior automatically assumes not only that he is the God to pulling, but that whenever a battle goes sour, it's always the Rogue's fault. I'm not saying that, in your experience, the Rogue hasn't caused his share of problems, but that is ENTIRELY due to you playing with apparently horrendous players, and not due to any inherent weaknesses within yourself or any other class. That you actually bought into all that BS is just all the more saddening, [right][snapback]66387[/snapback][/right]

Things will go wrong in battle. The key to it is knowing the capabilities of your fellow party mates and communicating. If there is a bad pull then it is my responsibility as tank to gain all the aggro I can to protect the squishies. If the rogue can help by gouging one and assisting the squishies with whittling down the numbers all the better. But if we wipe on a bad pull the entire party is at fault.

As a mild aside, I spoke earlier about a bad patch in an instance where I learned the hard way that it's up to the Rogue to pull mobs off a caster. We were going up against Van Cleef, and everything was going fine. I had thrown a Distraction in the room, attracting the attention of Cleef and his henchmen. I pulled the big VC with a Throwing knife to the face (he was none too pleased with this, and came out to tell me as much), the Tank (a Paladin, IIRC) immediately pounced on him and took aggro off me in a matter of seconds, and I was busy chewing him and his minions to pieces with my attacks. Where everything broke down was when he summoned up more minions, and they almost immediately went after the casters. I, foolishly, thought I should stay on VC, as I had always heard that the Rogue was a DPS machine and as such felt my place was at the Tank's side. [right][snapback]66387[/snapback][/right]

The key to winning that scenario is for the tank to occupy Van Cleef and for the party to take down the rogues as quickly as possible. Also a rogue should be kept in some form of crowd control ie gouged or Polymorphed. Once both rogues are dead the party shifts their attention back to VC until he spawns more and the process is repeated.

In battle, the Rogue controls the flow of battle, letting everyone else play the more specific roles. Think of a Rogue as yourself while playing an RTS - the Mages are your heavy artillery, the Healers are self-explanatory, and the Tanks are the bulk of your offensive arm - while also adding in your own bit to the offensive front.
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I'm sorry but the flow of battle is dictated by the healer not the rogue. Not the tank and not the casters. You rail against being shoe-horned into a DPS machine but are more than willing to do the same to your party mates. Each class brings something to a fight but that group won't get very far without healing. If the healer doesn't have mana then the group should not proceed. If it looks like there are going to be more adds than the group is comfortable with then it is up to the group to decide on what CC to use, to communicate a battle plan for everyone to use.